I totally agree - it looks like we have to wait until the AI gets itself into gear.
Basically Wyze are removing a feature just to make the AI a bit quicker for the “many”… Just invest in faster systems Wyze.
My first post on this situation treated it as a mistake - but now I know it was done on purpose that just makes it worse.
I have now just got to research other makes of camera - several of mine are built into wall lights so I need to find replacements of a similar size… Then I’m leaving as being able to respond to events asap after getting the notification was a selling point for me.
The requested change in the Fix-it Friday to which you are referring as it pertains to the Wyze imposed six second limitation on AI notifications was initiated by me. It has nothing to do with this issue: clicking on a notification and being taken to a live view (stream from cam) with no video control as opposed to the previous way of being taken to a recording in progress (stream from AWS) WITH video control.
That is the functionality that has been removed.
And, if the notification has already arrived on the device, be it motion notification or an AI notification because that is what you are clicking on to be taken to the live view, the AI interrogation has already completed within the 6 seconds and already returned that notification of such to you.
The six second issue is specifically when the AI interrogation takes longer than 6 seconds and AI Event notification is on but All other Motion notification is off. In that instance, no notification is received at all
I am with @jayjbarrow on this one. A wishlist item for a removed function is pointless. The reasoning for the change has not been provided by Wyze, but the implication is clear.
There was a fix it Friday response at some point that explained this exact change. There were issues with inconsistent behavior if it were to take you to the events sometimes and sometimes live view, so in the end they chose to just do live view only. They said they are hoping to change this in the future when they are able to process events faster.
I have been following the Fix-it Friday threads from the beginning and don’t remember any mention of removing the video controls from the live view launched from an event or an event notification that is still in the process of recording. Please provide a link because I am at a loss for finding it.
Is this the issue you referenced? But this is dealing with SD card footage.
Or this one which discusses a loss in notifications for AI events taking longer than 6 seconds?
Live view never had video controls, only the events did. You used to be taken to the events page, and you would see the video controls. Now you are taken to live view, where there aren’t and never have been video controls.
Thanks for all the feedback on the new event live feature. You are right! We modified it, replacing the slider live page ( let’s call it KVS live stream) with the non-slider live page (let’s call it TUTK live stream). The purpose of the modification is to enhance user’s expereince. Technically, the TUTK live stream solution is more stable and responsive than the KVS stream. We have received substantial feedback from end users that the KVS live function would have technical glitches sometimes and their it failed to play consequently. The glitches were due to the complexity of AWS KVS system and the random instability of network, which could not be root out. Comparing with the KVS live solution, the TUTK peer-to-peer live solution’s connection success rate and average setup time are much better. We have made such a desicion from the technology perspective.
When planning the modification, we standed in users shoes to think what functions the users need when they enter the live page. Based on our research, the major users want to check what is happening in front of the camera immeidately. For example, when a fox sneak into the henhouse, the live stream should show the user that the hens are under attack and the user should yell out to the fox and get it out there. The user might check the saved events to understand the details afterwards.
Based on the scenario, we designed the app jumping to the live page directly by tapping an event notification within 20-second of pop-up or tapping the CamPlus live incon under the Event page. Also, we did not expect it would bring about any confusions for it is one of the most widely used.
Also, we asked the dev the team to integrate the TUTK live stream with the origial KVS player, make it more consistent. However, due to the technical compatibilty, we can’t make it in a few interations. Overall, we made this change with considering all factors that we could.
We know it is not perfect, but we want this function can serve more users with more cases. Please let us know your suggestions and we will make improvements continously.
Sorry for any inconvinince, and thanks for your support.
So I get to chase the fox away AFTER it has attacked the hens? Then if they are not dead I will have to put them out of their misery? Thanks for that!!!
The foxes pass by my house and the hens are at a distance from it. Foxes have established “runs” and I need to see them before they cause any damage or death. I cannot run a cable that distance to power another camera near the hens.
There is a real need to know a fox is about as soon as possible and the present situation prevents that. In fact, by the time I see the live view the fox has passed by and I have taken to opening a window so at least I can hear when a fox is causing damage. I bought these cameras because they allowed me to see the fox pass by BEFORE it caused any damage … and now they do not do that!
It looks like my hens will be locked inside for the foreseeable future. The same goes for my cat - it has been attacked twice and was only saved because I could get outside quickly and scare the fox away. Even a few seconds matter in such a situation.
By the way - I have had no instability using the previous system.
SUGGESTION: Maybe you need a redesign so that users can choose which stream they want by choosing an option in the settings page of each camera.
Just had a thought! - maybe I should get rid of my hens and cat - because your systems cannot handle a real life situation.
I’m not sure if I understand the issue, the previous system showed you a recording of something that happened 30 seconds earlier, while the new system shows you what’s currently happening right this second. I think I would prefer to see the foxes and have quick access to the mic button than to just watch when they walked up and have to navigate out of events, to the cam, load the live view and then see it. Maybe we’re misunderstanding what your saying?
What good does watching the recording of the fox attacking your chickens do? No matter how fast wyzes ai is, the events are 12 seconds, so you can never watch the event before it takes place…
I have turned off all of the options in AI and rely on the ordinary motion events as the AI never managed to differentiate between another cat, a fox, a Badger, s rabbit etc. I just use a more accurate and reliable Human Intelligence.
In the past I have received a notification of movement after the thing that triggered it had left the field of view. I could quickly rewind and see which animal triggered it. If it was a fox then I could go outside with a flashlight which was enough to scare away the fox before it got to the hens.
This means that I am not going outside for every event and trying to scare rabbits and other non-threat animals away.
Live view is no use for this as the trigger has left the field of view, and waiting for the event screen to show is too slow. If I managed to put a camera near the hens then I would see a live view of the fox doing the damage which is no use at all.
It all worked fine until the last update and I am now relying on listening through an open window - at least I can hear a disturbance albeit later than when I could rewind in the event screen before the last update.
Basically, I tested one cam to see if it would work as I wanted before buying seven more - now they do not work as they did when I tested them.
The whole idea was to place cameras to monitor the runs that the foxes always use to get to the hens - unfortunately every other animal also uses the same runs. Monitoring the runs gave me sufficient time to take action if needed.
It looks like I am going to have to change the fencing around the hens once again - but it doesn’t take a fox long find a way in. The technology was a substitute to physical barriers akin to Fort Knox - but not any more.
For my purposes the cameras may as well be broken.
The hens by the way are pets - so it matters to me that they are safe.
I am sure there are other people who have requirements for a similar system and also bought Wyze - just to find out that the cams don’t perform as they did before the last update.
I have a front door camera that keeps watch for people. It also keeps an eye on my cats. I have a doorbell but many people don’t know it’s there or choose not to ring it. Especially delivery drivers. They drop packages off on my door step but I also have medication delivered that requires a signature. So imagine a delivery driver standing at my door waiting for a signature but I don’t get notified until after the event is finished recording. The driver could have stepped out of frame while waiting because I have a large front porch. The recording time could very well take several minutes depending on the motion. By the time I walk to the front door, the delivery person or mailman could have already hopped back into their vehicle and drove away. It’s nobody’s business why I need to back up that live event capture, I just need to continue doing it because Wyze roped us in with that feature and then unceremoniously took it away.
It was a selling point for me - much more so than the AI which I didn’t find very accurate when I did actually use it.
Another observation I have only just noticed - I have been plagued with two notifications for each event ever since the AWS outage - I have reported it to Wyze but nothing happened about it.
Now I see the point of having two notifications - the first one arrives when the event starts and the second one arrives when the event had been recorded and I can see the event view rather than the live view when I tap on the thumbnail … I can’t imagine Wyze planned it to work like that!
It is still showing “live” - therefore I cannot rewind to the start of the event for over 4 minutes… Ok it was a long recording (and not of a fox this time) … But over 4 minutes before I can look at what triggered the event. Seriously - is this acceptable??
Previously, it WAS a near real time ‘live’ view of video currently recording to AWS with the slider that allowed you to ‘rewind’ within that same UI to review the previously recorded footage of the currently recording video on AWS KVS (Amazon Kenesis Video Stream). That functionality was lost with the move to TUTK (ThroughTek Co., LTD Taiwan) which now only streams P2P from the cam in love view rather than from the AWS recorded footage in near real time.
Others have different preferences as they have different application scenarios\landscapes and have been successfully using the old functionality for some time without the so called stability issues. The loss of usefully functionality is an issue to some. Perhaps for those who did rely on this functionality, it is a game changer issue.
You are assuming users are not getting full length video in CamPlus which can be up to 5 minute videos.
So, my original hypothesis didn’t go deep enough. The move was not to reduce the near real time AWS download streams of still recording events launched from notifications, it was to completely terminate them all together in favor of real time P2P streaming thru TUTK.
Those are good points, I didn’t think about it for those use cases, and clearly Wyze didn’t either.
I think Wyze still uses KVS for events, and has used TUTK for live view. The only thing that has changed is that they now use it for viewing notifications as well.
Events are processed like this:
Camera sees motion, starts recording.
After 6 seconds, the clips is sent to AWS for ai processing and notification. This is done after 6 seconds so you don’t have to wait the full length of the video before getting the notification.
Then it keeps recording, until max length is up, or it doesn’t see motion. The full event video is now uploaded to AWS, where it’s accessible in the app.
This makes it so if you were to view the events page right as a notification is sent, the video won’t be done recording, and it won’t be uploaded so you get an error. It can only be a few seconds if it’s a short video, but if it’s long your gunna have to wait a long time.
The new system was supposed to improve this by taking you to live view, but I don’t think it was considered that the subject may only be visible for the first few seconds.
As you suggested, an option to switch between both would be the best bet since there’s obv a real use case for both of them.
Everything I said is just how I think the system works, but I’m probably not 100% right on all of it. Im not sure how you were able to watch the event video as soon as you had clicked the notif, unless the video was only a few seconds long?