New Beta App released on 8/14

I’ve found some odd behavior… the first symptom was that my shortcut ordering was forcibly rearranged during last week’s outage. Once service was restored, I could no longer place shortcuts in the order I prefer. This was all under the GA app.

Rejoined the beta to see if that would jostle caches or other things governing, and sure enough I was able to arrange shortcuts again. However, any that I had automated were converted into “schedules” and became unavailable as actual shortcut buttons. That’s pretty presumptuous to decide for me that I can no longer manually actuate something that I’ve also scheduled… :slight_smile:

Left the beta again to see if the GA app would now allow manual arrangement, and no dice. Unclear if something within the beta conversion process somehow tags automated items, but this makes things really confusing for my parents. I’d FINALLY gotten them into a groove about which shortcut to use at particular times of day / situations, and now they have been randomly shuffled.

Please give folks the choice about whether to convert automated shortcuts into “schedules” (or at least leave the manual button in place) and let us keep things arranged as we see fit!

So sorry for your issues. I know how difficult it can be when the “rules” change rather suddenly. The issue of the sort order is being addressed, but I believe it will take a new release of the firmware to do so.

The Beta app extends shortcut functionality significantly. In essence the same manual ‘shortcut’ buttons still exist but some of the terminology has changed. It may help to think of the new ‘rules’ as the old ‘shortcuts’. If you are willing to rejoin the beta I can probably guide you into recreating your old shortcuts in the new format. As far as your parents would be concerned nothing would appear to have changed.

Bear in mind, it is a beta so there is a potential for things not working, and for things to change as the beta progresses. Again so sorry you encountered this.

Roger that, R.Bruce… but the initial problem I described is with the GA app. I rejoined the beta program solely as a test to see if shortcut control might be regained. Also, I have no problem keeping the items separate in my thought process - however I much preferred the dual functionality of both manual and automated control. Doesn’t make sense to have to build the same thing twice. This is exactly the sort of task where technology is supposed to simplify our lives - not create double the work :slight_smile:

I’m sorry to say that firmware “upgrades” are not a viable solution for me. I’ve found (and described in several threads) that Cam Pan firmwares beyond radically alter the reliability of recorded footage for playback. Curious to know why a firmware upgrade would be required to effect what is essentially software behavior?

My parents are 500mi away from me and the “have trouble” firmware reversion feature has been removed. Not trying brick their cameras with no remote recourse. Way too much other trouble reported beyond the trouble I’ve actually experienced with later firmware.

Thanks for listening, however. Hopefully the dev team is monitoring chatter.

I don’t know for sure a new firmware is necessary, just something I recall reading. I have run into one other person that also said the more recent firmware releases caused positioning issues with their Pan Cams. But I have to say most I know have not found that to be an issue. I wonder if there are other factors at play somehow. In my own case my Pan does not appear to suffer thankfully, from any ill effects.

Again I am sorry for your difficulties, I do know that Wyze very definitely monitors this forum but if you want to certain of their involvement definitely contact support.

This post: Wyze App Service Outage - 8/22/19 - #210 by WyzeGwendolyn did initially say “firmware” but has since been corrected to say it’s an app update that will be needed.

Also, while Wyze employees are sometimes present on the forum, it is intended as primarily as user-to-user community. If you need support, the proper thing to do is to make a Support Request

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Knew I had read it somewhere just could not remember where.

I know that you’re only trying to be helpful, R.Bruce, and I do appreciate it.

First off, the issues I’ve had with firmware haven’t been with physical positioning. They have been with the fact that once they tethered local recording to the cloud standard, much footage was missing when I went to review playback - routine footage that would’ve normally been captured with the .40 firmware. I haven’t tested with anything beyond .60/65 since Im at a distance; and also because I don’t really see a whole lot of detail about what’s been addressed in the firmware updates themselves. I’m a network engineer/admin by trade and we do appreciate knowing specifics… :slight_smile:

Second, I did submit several support tickets (at the behest of WyzeRoy). Spent several hours reviewing and documenting my findings prior to submittal. All that I ever rec’d back were platitudinal responses, acknowledgements that I had sent them something, etc.

Third, the only other “factors at play” from my perspective are that I’ve actually performed before & after testing to verify my claims. It would be nice to have the sense that this was occuring a little more robustly during development as well. I encourage Wyze not to wade too deeply into the Microsoft-esque update standard whereby the cure becomes worse than the original condition. An ounce of prevention (gentle, conservative development) is usually preferable to a pound of cure (sudden, drastic, forethought-lacking paradigm shifts that impair bread & butter functionality).

Unfortunately it seems all I can offer is further platitudes. I did read some of your other posts awhile back but was unable to duplicate your results. I am sure others have so I will wish you well but I can’t offer you any suggestions that are new or different than those you have already received.

Haha, well thanks for at least listening and taking the time to review what I have previously posted.

Two things would restore my Wyze world to harmony:

  1. Introduce a toggle that allows users to choose whether local and cloud storage are synchronized. To me the whole point of having a local storage option is to have greater control if the cloud is unavailable. I do also agree with other posts that I’ve read that cloud capture can be spotty (as is anything Internet dependent). Local storage was always a hedge against any instability there until recent firmware.

  2. Preserve the original shortcut buttons. The scheduler idea is very good and I like it. However, it should be non-destructive and duplicate the buttons with some clear delineation of same. It would even be a clever thing to synchronously update the schedule item whenever one modifies the shortcut button.

That is all I have to say about that… :smiley:

I can only offer information on your first issue. The cloud storage is only for events (motion or sound or both), the recordings for the cloud are all 12 seconds long. There is a 5 minute cool down period following an event which will prevent similar events from recording to the cloud during that period. This is per camera.

So for instance if a person walks within view of your camera and you have event detection (motion) enabled a 12 second video clip will be sent to the cloud and will become viewable to you on the Events tab for 14 days. However in the next 5 minutes an elephant could walk by your camera and it would NOT be recorded to the cloud nor generate another event notification.

Therefor there really is no way to ever have the local event recordings which are a minimum of 60 seconds long and the cloud events of 12 second duration followed by 5 minutes of nothing, to be synchronized.

There is discussion over the possibility of extended cloud recording at user cost (right now it’s free) but I have not heard of any pending release as of yet.

Understood, R.Bruce,

And you are actually making my point for me here somewhat… Firmware beta v4.10.3.46 release notes included this per the 3/25 thread I quoted above:

  • Improved the security of time lapse download;
  • Fixed the reboot issue with no internet connection;
  • Improved the compatibility in mesh network;
    - Applied the detection zone and sensitivity settings on local recording;
  • Security updates;

I do use motion detection with the entire viewing area as my zone. After upgrading, very blatant movements (sometimes repetitive) started going absent. Once the detection zone & sensitivity settings got applied to local storage, stuff that I’d expect to see was significantly reduced. Based on everything I have observed and what you have added, some combination of motion or the local storage recording/honoring only what gets sent to the cloud is responsible.

All I’m saying is that I would like this setting to be optional. Local storage with the former relaxed/liberal policy works much better for me. Since I’ve paid extra to have a local micro SD card installed, why must I be restricted to the free cloud standard? I’d like my footage back please… :slight_smile:

Ok I think I understand what you are saying. However I think you may be not be interpreting some things as they were meant.

First a detection zone is meant to limit the area in which motion detection applies. If you turn the zone off entirely the entire viewing area is considered for motion.

The sensitivity settings are likewise used to tune just how much motion qualifies as an event. The higher the sensitivity is set the less motion is required to trigger an event.

So in essence you can consider these settings to be on a toggle. The old behavior would be with sensitivity set to 100% and detection zone set to off.

Hey R.Bruce,

Yessir, I fully comprehend what the detection zone is… its the little green box you can redraw/position to limit/include where the camera should consider motion relevant for recording. I actually use this on one cam to exclude a ceiling fan. As I mentioned, however, I set the detection zone to full-frame and on for my other cams. Turning the detection zone off entirely has had some undesirable effects for me in the past and I’ve never considered that as an option. I don’t recall precisely, but something I was trying to use complained that I didn’t have a detection zone enabled. Are you saying that disabling the zone entirely is actually how to set the zone as full-frame? Seems a little counter-intuitive, but I’ll keep it in mind for future testing.

The 100% sensitivity sounds fishy to me. I did experiment upping the sensitivity from default in increments of (5) points just to see the impact. I found (and documented in the 3/25 thread) high levels of false positives going much above (51).

I’ll add a little more background into my Cam Pan config… while I don’t use (or have enabled) pan&scan or motion tracking, I did configure waypoints in the Motor Controls section. I’ve found these useful since I have different points to which I periodically retrain these cams.

I’m not really in a position to test new firmware on my parents’ cams since I wont be at their place until Thanksgiving time most likely. I’ll have another go at whatever the current release may be at that time. However, I’m still in an "if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it " holding pattern (same as switches, routers, etc at work) until I’ve had opportunity to test onsite - especially since firmware can no longer be reverted via the app.

Anyhow, thanks for the ongoing discussion. Might actually zero in on a solution at some point… :slight_smile:

You are welcome! :grin: And yes turning the detection zone off is equivalent to turning detection on full frame. Higher detection sensitivity settings will generate more false positives so I tune mine over time. Outdoor cameras that have a lot of wind blown foliage I tend to use much lower settings for. Indoor areas I like you, exclude ceiling fans from motion zones but generally find higher settings more useful.

I try to avoid anything like a tv that has constant motion on it. My cats occasionally trigger a false positive but not too often. :slightly_smiling_face:

Haha… word!

And just to make sure we’re on the same page… since you’ve said disabled/full-frame enabled are equivalent, there shouldn’t be any negative effects for me to keep the detection zone enabled at full-frame, yes?

I’m the type of person who’d rather have too much footage than not enough. I can deal with some foliage sway & shadow play erring on the side of caution and capturing more vs less. That actually gives me confidence that things that SHOULD BE recorded will be recorded. The opposite is true when I notice things going missing - a bad feeling that my cams are missing things they should be capturing.

Cats are a hoot. Someone once offered me proof that the Earth is round… it couldn’t possibly be flat because cats would’ve long since knocked everything off it. Ha!

As far as I know you are correct. I have not read anything to the contrary anyway. :grinning:


Not to keep running over the same roadkill, but I came across Loki’s comment here to better illustrate my issue:

My point is that I preferred the way local storage operated semi-autonomously vs cloud recording standards. The whole 5min cooldown period, etc hamstrings recording of what might be very pertinent footage right in front of cams that I expect to capture same. Let’s say some thugs decide to spray paint graffiti on an outer wall at my place. Let’s say further that they’re not the brightest thugs and spend 15-20min painting in front of a cam in plain view. Based on other discussions/threads I’ve read, there’s a high likelihood that much of this similar activity will simply be missed. Local storage minus this stricture used to capture it… from dogs pooping in the yard to mobile car detailers, I want it all :smiley:

Speculating here, but my hunch is that since Wyze offers free 14-day cloud storage (thank u, btw Wyze!) they must pay for it in some bulk rate. I’m no cloud expert, but I’d also expect that there is a tendency to be on the frugal side determining what gets uploaded so as not to blow up storage allowances - in whatever metric they’re billed. Bottom line to me is that I DON’T WANT the local storage to honor the cloud settings and I notice a huge difference when it does. It seems essentially like shooting the local storage feature in the foot when it should be a hedge against the cloud/cooldown shortcoming. Allowing me to toggle this behavior off/on would make me a very happy camper!

I still think I am missing something. You are not belaboring a point I take it that you are trying to express a concern and I am, so far, failing to fully comprehend it.

Haha, well I probably still have the details from my support tickets that I can send your way. The play-by-play might make more sense than high level abstract.

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